The Trek fandom is basically the original series crew running around the ship drunk like in “The Naked Time.”
I think you’re right.
Anonymous said: can i be educated as to why his characterization was wrong?
- "We have orders. We should follow them." Steve. Steve Rogers. Steve "well looks like I have to go behind enemy lines to go save my best friend and company and you can’t tell me otherwise" Rogers. Steve "sixth time is the charm at the carnival recruiting office" Rogers. I’m not buying it, Joss.
- "I get that reference." We all know that Steve was under ice for 70 years, thus he missed a lot. He keeps a notebook of things he should look up, sure, but for him to be like HEY EVERYONE THE OLD GUY GOT THIS doesn’t strike me as believable. It seems like a shoddy shot at comic relief at Steve’s expense. Steve Rogers is the guy who takes the confused look on someone’s face and explains the reference to them, not the guy who points out that he understood it.
- "We need a plan of attack!" because jumping out of an airplane before you get to your destination, while being fired at, and trying to single handedly complete a rescue mission with a handgun and a metal shield is definitely backing this line of thought up.
- “Let’s start with that stick of his. It may be magical…" "is that what just happened" and "seems to be powered by some sort of electricity" remind me of painting Steve as the naive, less intelligent younger brother that everyone gets tired of explaining everything thing to. Steve has a vocabulary. Steve Rogers grew up with electricity. He knows what it is. Steve Rogers also could have just said that it worked like the Hydra weapon, except there are these unnecessary comments to make Steve seem less than everyone else. I hate that whole scene.
- "What’s the matter? afraid of a little lightning?" since when does Steve mock other people like that? Sure, he was smarmy towards the Red Skull ("Nothin’. I’m just a kid from Brooklyn" "So why are you running?") but they’re retaliations. He doesn’t start that sort of thing. That’s Tony’s job.
- The whole “there’s only one God, ma’am” thing. It just seems so proper and Steve isn’t really proper or good with women, especially ones he’s just met. He doesn’t call Peggy ma’am when he’s conversing with her, he fumbles over “dame, woman, agent.” He also doesn’t seem the kind to bring God into things, even when Schmidt was “harnessing the power of the gods.” The whole line/situation irked me, and that just might be more subjective than objective, so you can ignore this point if you think it has too much fallacy in it.
- Steve always comes up one quip short with Tony. Continually. That might just be a nit-picky thing, but I don’t like it. Smart-mouthed Steve Rogers doesn’t keep playing into somebody’s hand the way he does with Tony. Steve is used to bantering with people- with Bucky, with the people who beat him up - he doesn’t back down with “one more wisecrack out of you” or any of that.
If you like Whedon’s characterization of Steve, that’s fine. You are welcome to your opinion, just as I am to mine. I wouldn’t say his characterization is poor more than it is wrong.
I’m going to say that I’m going with “Minor Brain Damage” Steve for Whedon’s characterisation. Steve isn’t invulnerable; he can be injured, though he’ll recover himself back to new. So I’m going to say for the Avengers that this isn’t Steve being Steve, this is Steve with the neurological damage from being frozen for 70 years. It’s subtle stuff, which is why SHIELD let him out in the field, but damage nonetheless. He’s recovered and back to his normal self by Cap 2. The beauty of this explanation is that it will work for any characterisation stuff-up in Avengers 2 - he has had a lot of blows to the head in Cap 2. It’ll take time for him to get over them. But he’ll be himself again for Cap 3.
JUST NOTICED LAST NIGHT THAT BUCKY WAS ALSO ON A DRIP IN THE ENTIRE CHAIR SCENE
I know it’s a fucked up scene, I do, but that to me just is nOPE. What the fuck are they putting into his system on top of the mind wiping and the physical abuse and the conditioning.
THE TUBE ON THE BACK OF HIS RIGHT HAND, IS THAT A DRIP?
Dr. Cyan calling in here, and yes, that is absolutely a peripheral IV cannula on his right hand. Watching the scene carefully you can see the IV stand on his right, with two infusion bags attached (sorry for the crappy images, maybe someone can grab a better screenshot if they have the DVD):
If you watch frame by frame, you can see that Bucky pops the connection tube off when he attacks the med tech; it dangles freely from the IV bag when the guards move to point their guns at him. In real life he’d probably have torn the cannula out of his hand entirely; it happens all the time with little old ladies in my ER so I was disappointed the directors didn’t draw on that particular body horror/’ouch’-factor here.
The infusion bags appear to be one 1,000 mL isotonic saline or D5W/D5NS (dextrose/glucose in a saline solution) for tissue rehydration, and one 500 mL isotonic saline, most likely a diluent for injectable/parenteral drug administration:
Which drug? Well, it could be any HYDRA concoction, but I’d put my money on the tried-and-true fallback of some benzodiazepine. BZDs/derivatives are anxiolytic (anxiety-reducing), hypnotic (sedative/sleep-inducing), anticonvulsant (good for when you’re electrocuting someone’s brain), amnestic (affecting memory), and myorelaxant (muscle-relaxing), a nice cocktail for working with the Winter Soldier - and hey! paradoxical BZD reactions include aggression and violence (such as attacking attending medical staff), and it may also cause anterograde amnesia as well as internalised feelings of turmoil, anxiety, depression, and loss of the ability to experience and/or express feelings. Plus, withdrawal can cause depression, depersonalisation, derealisation, hypersensitivity, psychosis, and suicidal ideation - sounds like a lot of Bucky-in-from-the-cold fanfics, am I right?
Seriously, writing this, I’m wondering where the withdrawal!Bucky fanfics are - the fics I’ve read all focus on his mental issues, but what about the physiological ones? I’d really like to read a fic about Bucky coming off whatever HYDRA pumped him full of - now that’d make for some neat hurt/comfort (and a lot of curling up on Steve’s bathroom floor shaking and puking his guts out).
(When I get my hands on a HD copy of the movie I’ll have a look at the rest of the medical setup in that scene. I’m especially interested in the screens behind the chair - maybe some more medical meta to be explored? Please send any screenshots my way if you have them!)
The medical meta is interesting, but it’s based on medical practice right now. Bucky’s been under Hydra’s control since World War Two. At the point he came to them, legitimate psychiatric treatments included insulin shock therapy and lobotomy; people thought barbiturates were safe. What if they keep on using stuff that they started using in the 40s and 50s because it worked then, and he’s got a supersoldier metabolism that discourages them from experimenting with medication? What if that drip is actually insulin to drop him into a hypoglycaemic coma? Or a cocktail of barbituates and antipsychotics and other medications that were taken off the market years ago?